Burning vehicles again near Petatlán

by JACK @, Friday, November 08, 2019, 09:07 (34 days ago)

Burning vehicles again near Petatlán

by midalake @, Friday, November 08, 2019, 09:16 (34 days ago) @ JACK

Marshmallows, anyone? :devil:

D

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Same old problem

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Friday, November 08, 2019, 09:46 (34 days ago) @ JACK

It’s all over, Jack. The road is open again.

Do you even know what their beef is? They want the Policía Estatal to leave the region so they can cultivate their poppies in peace. Another symptom. Not the problem. The problem remains the failed laws and policies that empower organized criminals seeking to supply U.S. consumers. Like I said elsewhere recently, we all know why there are cartels and where their money and firearms come from.

Same old problem

by JACK @, Friday, November 08, 2019, 11:05 (34 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

It’s all over, Jack. The road is open again.

Do you even know what their beef is? They want the Policía Estatal to leave the region so they can cultivate their poppies in peace. Another symptom. Not the problem. The problem remains the failed laws and policies that empower organized criminals seeking to supply U.S. consumers. Like I said elsewhere recently, we all know why there are cartels and where their money and firearms come from.

My point was to alert anyone planning on heading south. Glad it's over.

You ask: "Do you even know what their beef is?" I can read the papers as well as you, be it in English, Spanish or French. I also live here so I am as close as you are to the situation. I also travel to Petatlán, Lázaro Cárdenas and other places often to visit friends or other reasons. If I had planned to be heading to Petatlán today I would have been glad that someone would have given me a heads up.

The newspapers here report nothing...burying your head in the sand does nothing good for anybody.

Same old problem

by zulualpha, Friday, November 08, 2019, 15:59 (34 days ago) @ JACK

You are right, Jack, that the blacking-out by local news outlets of stories like this one serves zero purpose. Details of this incident, including video clips, were all over Facebook minutes after it occurred.

Information sources/outlets engaged in censorship or sanitizing of news reports risk losing credibility, and thus usefulness.
_____
Award-winning Mexican journalist Léon Krauze sometimes writes on Mexico´s struggle with drugs, and most recently (Nov. 5th) had a good piece in the Washington Post on Guerrero´s opium poppy dilema.

Same old problem

by Casa Juan @, Friday, November 08, 2019, 12:52 (34 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I question whether growing poppies would be a reason with the prices collapsing due to cheaper and more powerful synthetics being widely available

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by frostbite ⌂ @, Hamilton MT, Friday, November 08, 2019, 13:41 (34 days ago) @ Casa Juan

It's for the vegan junkies!

--
[image]
Casa Amarilla Vacation Rental
http://www.casa-amarilla-zihua.com/

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by mexicoman @, Zihuatanejo, Friday, November 08, 2019, 16:28 (34 days ago) @ frostbite

:megusta: :dude:

Same old problem

by mcnuttja, Monday, November 11, 2019, 16:46 (31 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Rob, while I understand the current situation has a large bearing upon the US, this is not a US only issue. If I am not mistaken, Mexico has a rich, lengthy and deep history of corruption.

Your cartel issue has reached into the "local" economy and into the local population. To the point that your local Cab/Taxi drivers are shaken-down regularly. Over my last 15 years of visits I have made some local friends. One being a Taxi driver and have heard the tales first hand.

Is Mexico more or less safe than the US? I don't think so. And I will continue to visit.

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Same old problem

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, November 11, 2019, 17:52 (31 days ago) @ mcnuttja

Rob, while I understand the current situation has a large bearing upon the US, this is not a US only issue. If I am not mistaken, Mexico has a rich, lengthy and deep history of corruption.

Your cartel issue has reached into the "local" economy and into the local population. To the point that your local Cab/Taxi drivers are shaken-down regularly. Over my last 15 years of visits I have made some local friends. One being a Taxi driver and have heard the tales first hand.

Is Mexico more or less safe than the US? I don't think so. And I will continue to visit.

:wtf:
Really? You've got The Chump in the White House and you want to tell me about how corrupt Mexico is? R U 4 real?

Cartels in Zihuatanejo? Not exactly. Lázaro is their big prize on this coast. We're just one of the scraps for the junkyard dogs. As long as we keep supplying passing vessels in the night with fuel there's nothing for them to fight over here.

Same old problem

by mcnuttja, Tuesday, November 26, 2019, 09:25 (16 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I agree we have a chump in the WH. But, the Chump doesn't have an impact on past Mexican history. Nothing here to argue with, as it has been a long-known fact.

As I have stated, the cartels are a part of your local economy and have been for some time. Their near recent (2016) move into the Taxi business via "payolla" shake-down of the local Taxi drivers is evidence of that presence.

I am quite sure the Taxi business is not the only one.

Head up or head in the sand, is your choice.........


Jerry

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Same old problem

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, November 26, 2019, 11:09 (16 days ago) @ mcnuttja

I agree we have a chump in the WH. But, the Chump doesn't have an impact on past Mexican history. Nothing here to argue with, as it has been a long-known fact.

As I have stated, the cartels are a part of your local economy and have been for some time. Their near recent (2016) move into the Taxi business via "payolla" shake-down of the local Taxi drivers is evidence of that presence.

I am quite sure the Taxi business is not the only one.

Head up or head in the sand, is your choice.........


Jerry

Amigo, taxis and other businesses have been getting shaken down here since WAY before 2016. It used to be just the políticos, union leaders and the Tránsitos who shook them down, then the politicians invited in tens of thousands more people to vote for them. But when things really got bad was when the USA stupidly allowed the assault weapons ban to expire. That's when we basically lost our police forces as they quickly became outgunned.

And bums who refuse to do honest work for a living but who have easy access to firearms thanks to absurd U.S. laws fill the vacuum left by the absence of law enforcement. You can call them cartels if you like. I call them bums and cowards with firearms. A cartel is what they have in Culiacán, Sinaloa that chased away the military. The military comes here to Zihuatanejo and "can't find" any cartel except up in the sierra in the Tierra Caliente.

Same old problem

by mcnuttja, Tuesday, November 26, 2019, 13:34 (16 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I think we are in near agreement. The US Gun Lobby has been outta control for years along with the need for assault weapons. But, Cartels/Lawlessness in Mexico existed prior to the Assault Weapon Ban expiration. To blame is too easy.......

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Same old problem

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, November 26, 2019, 14:21 (16 days ago) @ mcnuttja

I think we are in near agreement. The US Gun Lobby has been outta control for years along with the need for assault weapons. But, Cartels/Lawlessness in Mexico existed prior to the Assault Weapon Ban expiration. To blame is too easy.......

I don't think we see this the same. The cartels weren't “the enemy” until their leaders kept getting busted, killed and extradited and their replacements simply became thugs. They used to be mostly just businessmen working in cahoots with the government. The DEA changed all that when it handed them the cocaine trade after meddling in Colombia.

Lawlessness wasn't much of a problem here until the flood of military firearms hit Mexico. Always felt safer in Mexico than in the USA. We're at war with no one. No nukes. No school massacres.

Cartels are just criminal business enterprises. Take away the multi-billion dollar a year black market that supplies U.S. consumers and you remove the huge profit incentive and their raison d'être. If we only had street gangs and "normal" criminals to deal with our police would be much more effective.

Same old problem

by mcnuttja, Wednesday, November 27, 2019, 13:19 (15 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I do not agree and neither does documented history. The Cartels began to emerge after the US reused to allow Chinese to emigrate, I believe in the late 1880's. These Chinese settled in Mexico and began opium production. This led o to other drug related import. So, Mexico has had this problem a LONG time.......nothing new.......

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Same old problem

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, November 30, 2019, 09:18 (12 days ago) @ mcnuttja

I do not agree and neither does documented history. The Cartels began to emerge after the US reused to allow Chinese to emigrate, I believe in the late 1880's. These Chinese settled in Mexico and began opium production. This led o to other drug related import. So, Mexico has had this problem a LONG time.......nothing new.......

The most recent wave of Chinese live in the Mexicali region of the border area. Those are related to the wave of immigrants that helped build U.S. railroads. Before that there were Chinese here in southern Guerrero having come over on the Nao de China during a period of high commerce between our nations long before there ever was a USA or pale-faced gringos. But those have long ago assimilated into Mexican culture and mestizo-hood and their descendents now dwell mostly in Mexico City. Not in Guerrero. As for cartels and opium, Mexican opium was never a big money-maker until relatively recently in our history. Mexican brown was the dirt cheap stuff that had fallen out of favor and pretty much out of use until the opioid mass addiction crisis hit the USA. The war in Afghanistan also gave it a little help in the first years until production from Afghanistan actually INCREASED under the protection of the USA as their "war" there evolved into something else. Back before the opioid addiction bloomed, no one was fighting wars in the sierra of Guerrero to dominate the poppy trade, a problem we're actually watching wind down now as fentanyl replaces heroin among users in the USA. Though Guerrero has always been a "bronco" state, we weren't a war zone until the ban on assault weapons was lifted in the USA and the .50 cal Barretts started showing up here.

You're confusing cartels with smugglers. Mexicans have long smuggled alcohol, pot and to a lesser extent opium into the USA, though they were never the only ones. This whole business became a problem that got out of hand in large part thanks to the USA's "war on drugs" policy that put the cocaine smuggling operations into the hands of Mexican cartels, whether intentionally or not, you'll have to ask the DEA and I wouldn't trust a damn thing they said. I've lived here during much of this and watched this problem unfold and grow and get out of hand. It was nowhere near as bad as it is now until the US federal government allowed the ban on assault weapons to expire. That's when Mexico became a proxy war zone for the "war on drugs". Time for a new policy because that one has killed and injured more people than if the entire nation were addicted to whatever substances the USA is trying to ban its citizens from consuming.

Mexicans will not tolerate armed foreigners on their soil nor drone strikes. So whatever the US federal government does it had better tread very carefully. As things are the USA is practically an international pariah, but we're all still trying to stay positive, though it is extremely sad to watch such a wonderful nation fall so far from its previous position of respect in the world.

Same old problem

by zulualpha, Saturday, November 30, 2019, 16:26 (12 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

"...the ban on assault weapons was lifted and .50 calibre Barretts started showing up here."

This is a critical point to understand in any discussion on the "drug wars" in Mexico. Very few people have much idea of how the avalability of US military-grade assault weapons in the US has affected Mexico´s ability to maintain a safe and secure state for its citizens.

A brief summary:

1994 -- the Clinton Admin. imposes an US assault gun ban, to last for 10 years.

2004 -- the Bush Admin., spurred on by the NRA, 2nd Amendment boosters and the events of 9/11, does not renew the ban.

Massed-produced assault weapons, "legally" bought in the US now become available to Mexican organized crime groups, principally drug cartels.

Violence in Mexico escalates; Mexican security forces find themselves outgunned. Then Mexican President Felipe Calderón in early 2007 "sends the Army into the streets" to counter the increased armed might of criminals. The Bush Admin. offers logistical support and military training to Mexico in support of that effort, through the Mérida Accord.

2019 -- Colt announces an end to the manufacture of its trademark AR 15, the civilian version of the Vietnam-era M-16. The market for the AR 15, a favorite of Mexican mobsters, is saturated.

The beat goes on.....

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by Sunset Monger, Saturday, November 30, 2019, 17:47 (12 days ago) @ zulualpha

Let me get this straight. Guns and Death from Guns are a fault of the USA. And the Trump administration claims Drugs and Death from Drugs are fault of the Cartels of Mexico? Sounds like a fair trade agreement is already in place and a fairly lucrative one at that. Why would anyone want to stop such a lucrative enterprise? Mexico is not interested in stopping the cartels and the selling of drugs. It brings in Billions of $ to the economy. USA is not interested is stopping the sale of guns and promoting wars, It brings in Billions of $ to the economy.

Where is Oliver North when you need him to make a great deal.

Same old problem

by rojo, Saturday, November 30, 2019, 18:55 (12 days ago) @ Sunset Monger

Re Oliver North, I would contribute to any fund that sends North back to Costa Rica or Nicaragua for a holiday. He would spend at least 10 years as a guest of the stated governments for his actions in the Contra, guns for drugs, and breaking their neutrality laws (Costa Rica ) Oly was and is no different than todays terrorist

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Same old problem

by dhunsber @, ¡Dondequiera que voy, estoy aquí!, Saturday, November 30, 2019, 20:47 (12 days ago) @ Sunset Monger

Oliver North should be in prison and Ronnie Reagan should have been thrown out of office for their Iran-Contra shenanigans.

Same old problem

by mcnuttja, Monday, December 02, 2019, 08:14 (10 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I have a very good grasp of the history, PS quit using WIKI's. Interesting approach you have chosen to take with this, everything is wrong other than the thing that is wrong.......and having no culpability.......

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Same old problem

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, December 02, 2019, 08:57 (10 days ago) @ mcnuttja

I have a very good grasp of the history, PS quit using WIKI's. Interesting approach you have chosen to take with this, everything is wrong other than the thing that is wrong.......and having no culpability.......

Wikis?

Are you responding to me or someone else? My memory is the only resource I used, no Wiki anything (what an odd comment you make), though I did go and check some facts afterward (not using Wiki) only to be reinforced. You also made rather odd comment about Asians that had nothing to do with Guerrero or our current problems. You appear to want to explain the present situation via some obscure dubious history while I take a more socio-cultural approach from the perspective of someone who has lived this thing up close and personal. Cartels grew here just like the mafia did in the USA during Prohibition and for the exact same reason, only they've had longer to prosper here because the Prohibition is still in effect. No Chinese planted any poppies in Guerrero, and this is pretty much the opium capital of America. Before the DEA placed the cocaine trade in the hands of Mexican cartels, narco-related violence was another beast entirely. When it was just the pot trade being fought over things were handled much more discretely. None of the violence is good, but the factors that caused the situation we have now I believe I have explained correctly.

Your other comment doesn't appear to have anything to do with anything I stated (or maybe I need more coffee to get it). ;-)
Saludos

Same old problem

by Ironwood, Monday, November 11, 2019, 18:37 (31 days ago) @ mcnuttja

..... Is Mexico more or less safe than the US? I don't think so.

I'm confused. Which is it?

Same old problem

by mcnuttja, Tuesday, November 26, 2019, 09:27 (16 days ago) @ Ironwood

I do not, nor ever have considered, Mexico more or less secure. My point was to Cartel injection into the local economy and business.

Same old problem

by zkaliman, Sunday, December 01, 2019, 03:34 (11 days ago) @ mcnuttja

ZIHUA ROB FOR PRESIDENT ????????????