Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Elizabeth, Friday, February 07, 2020, 07:51 (51 days ago)

My husband was with a friend at a Sushi Restaurant in Ixtapa last night and heard 6 gunshots fired around 9:30pm. The employees gathered everyone in the restaurant to shelter. Then trucks with armed officials raced by to a location about a block from Emilios Pizza Restraunt. Does anyone know what happened?

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Katochiapet, Friday, February 07, 2020, 08:10 (51 days ago) @ Elizabeth

Reportedly two killed somewhere around Reubens. News came from people who saw the covered bodies.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by victorio, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 02:04 (50 days ago) @ Katochiapet

Hola
Was just at Zorros Ixtapa and heard about the shootings.
There were two small husband and wife kiosks near Ruebens that sold trinkets and such. The extortionists came in and demanded 400 pesos a day. They refused. The extortionists came back and killed the man and shot the wife in the face. She survived, thank goodness.
They were young and had three little kids

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by mosesk @, Ojai, CA, USA, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 08:19 (50 days ago) @ victorio

Hola
Was just at Zorros Ixtapa and heard about the shootings.
There were two small husband and wife kiosks near Ruebens that sold trinkets and such. The extortionists came in and demanded 400 pesos a day. They refused. The extortionists came back and killed the man and shot the wife in the face. She survived, thank goodness.
They were young and had three little kids

Makes me weak and makes me weep.
What can be done?
Anything?

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 09:38 (50 days ago) @ mosesk

Hola
Was just at Zorros Ixtapa and heard about the shootings.
There were two small husband and wife kiosks near Ruebens that sold trinkets and such. The extortionists came in and demanded 400 pesos a day. They refused. The extortionists came back and killed the man and shot the wife in the face. She survived, thank goodness.
They were young and had three little kids


Makes me weak and makes me weep.
What can be done?
Anything?

You can demand the USA be more responsible with their firearms. Ban assault weapons. Close "gun show" loopholes. Close businesses that sell to straw buyers. Background checks!! The flood of firearms into Mexico at over a quarter million a year fuels our violence, and any lazy-ass with a firearm feels they can steal from hard-working people. Apparently all that security at the U.S. border isn't capable of putting even a minor dent in the flow of firearms south.

We have the new Guardia Nacional, but thanks to two crazy presidents most of them are patrolling the border for undocumented migrants instead of fighting crime because the USA's newly crowned Prince of Darkness has deemed them public enemy number one and he has blackmailed Mexico into diverting resources to his cause. And in matters of organized crime local police wash their hands and claim it's a federal matter because that's what the law says. So don't expect any pronouncements, news bulletins or anything at all from the local government. The only thing they do is try to cover up news about incidents like this.

Or you could just vacation somewhere else and pretend this sort of thing doesn't happen there.

Really sorry to hear about the couple of vendors.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Rogerthat, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 11:12 (50 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

A Mexican friend of mine who lives in San Jose Ixtapa owns two Taurus pistols both made and purchased in Brazil. Next.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 12:33 (49 days ago) @ Rogerthat

A Mexican friend of mine who lives in San Jose Ixtapa owns two Taurus pistols both made and purchased in Brazil. Next.

Excuse me, but I don't find your anecdote relevant. Are you contradicting me? Because you have a "friend" who allegedly has two pistols (and we'll just assume you've actually seen them and somehow verified your claim and that neither you nor your "friend" are criminals) that somehow negates something I know for a fact? You'll have to do better, much better. I don't feel like frivolous bickering over this extremely serious matter.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by frostbite ⌂ @, Hamilton MT, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 12:07 (49 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I think the question was how to help the survivors, not how to change the policies of the US.

--
[image]
Casa Amarilla Vacation Rental
http://www.casa-amarilla-zihua.com/

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by guido01, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 12:21 (49 days ago) @ frostbite

Yea---always easier to blame someone else or something else.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 12:46 (49 days ago) @ guido01

Yea---always easier to blame someone else or something else.

Actually, it seems much easier for certain gringos to simply ignore the matter. Too many U.S. citizens want to take zero responsibility for the nefarious actions of their government, its reprehensible policies or the incredible damage caused around the world in the name of We The People. Only its patriots want to own up to and attend to such problems and to do better.

Global arms trade is a nearly 200 billion business and the US drives nearly 80% of it

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Rogerthat, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 13:13 (49 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Totally agree. The same night the innocents were shot in Ixtapa three were killed in my hometown on a city bus. True the US sends most of the weapons south and consumes most of the drugs that head north. My point was there are also guns manufactured and delivered from Latin and South America to Mexico.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 13:57 (49 days ago) @ Rogerthat

Totally agree. The same night the innocents were shot in Ixtapa three were killed in my hometown on a city bus. True the US sends most of the weapons south and consumes most of the drugs that head north. My point was there are also guns manufactured and delivered from Latin and South America to Mexico.

A minor and insignificant percentage.

I don't mean to berate people, but I do seek consistency in one's comments. Criminality in any society is fomented by many different factors. Not taking law enforcement seriously for decades has hampered Mexico's ability to deal with the principal complaint of its citizens for the past 3 decades: la inseguridad. But just like the USA's own mafia had a huge surge during the USA's period of prohibition of alcohol, the longer prohibition of what have turned out to be very popular and lucrative substances has empowered and entrenched even more thoroughly the organized and violent criminals who dominate the black market of today's popular substances. One of the spinoffs of that gargantuan problem has been the flow of firearms south, fueling other problems for Mexico.

The very week after the ban on assault-style weapons was lifted in the USA during the Bush years, .50 cal Barretts began showing up here in Mexico and were used to ambush police, along with the assault weapons which were easily modified to full automatic. Police stations came under attack so much that our own had to build a fortress around its compound to prevent attacks. All police modules (the small two-room stations they operated out of in the colonias) were eventually abandoned because the police kept getting ambushed. This in part explains why we still don't have adequate municipal police protection. The criminals simply outgun them because they have more money to spend. So while Mexico takes full responsibility for what it can, the ease with which violent criminals are able to acquire firearms from the USA is another problem in the equation that must be solved if we are to get a grip on the matter. But unfortunately behind the scenes there are interests mostly north of the border who profit from a Mexico in turmoil, weakened by criminal activity. For folks who bother to look to history to better understand the present, we have seen this before.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Ironwood @, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 15:03 (49 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Re the flow of arms from the USA into Mexico:

I'm a little puzzled. Perhaps someone can explain things so I'll understand:

When we drive into Mexico from the USA, there is no requirement to stop at a US Customs or Immigration facility on the US side. The first official facility one encounters is a Mexican government facility right at the physical border. In most areas, it isn't necessary to stop at that location at all, you simply drive on by. The actual Mexican Customs and Immigration buildings are typically located several kilometers further into Mexico. The system is so loosey-goosey that we once took a wrong turn and drove right into, and miles through, the city of Nogales, Sonora, without going through Mexican Customs and Immigration at all. Had we had a trunk full of automatic weapons, no one would have been the wiser.

After we obtained our necessary Customs and Immigration papers at the Mexican border facility, we just continued driving into Mexico. Not once in the 8 or 9 times we've made the trip, has anyone at Mexican Customs bothered to check our vehicle, look in the trunk, etc.

I assume similar conditions exist at the borders between many other countries. It is certainly the case between the USA and Canada as well. So, whose responsibility is it to ensure that weapons are not being smuggled into Mexico, from the United States? Seems to me the burden falls on Mexico, not the USA.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by hromero ⌂ @, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 15:49 (49 days ago) @ Ironwood

Ironwood,

I think the point you miss is that Rob isn't saying that Mexico doesn't have responsibility, but that the policies of the U.S. have a huge impact here in Mexico that makes it far more difficult for Mexico to deal with those problems. If you are a U.S. citizen and want to know what you can do to help make the situation better for people you may or may not care for here in Mexico then you can start by try to affect change in U.S. policies that have huge impacts. If the U.S. had background checks for purchasing arms then maybe those arms couldn't be purchased by non-citizen to be illegally brought to Mexico. If the U.S. didn't blackmail the Mexican government into redirecting critical law enforcement resources towards border enforcement then maybe Mexico could be making more progress on improving security. If the U.S. didn't strong arm the Mexican people into making drugs illegal, perhaps Mexico could more easily create a secure environment for its citizens.

I think the point is that we U.S. citizens can best help by affecting a change in policies within our own government to make things better and that we need do that before assuming that we can come into Mexico like some great white savior.

--
Humberto Romero
www.casaarcoiriszihuatanejo.com

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 18:42 (49 days ago) @ Ironwood

Re the flow of arms from the USA into Mexico:

I'm a little puzzled. Perhaps someone can explain things so I'll understand:

When we drive into Mexico from the USA, there is no requirement to stop at a US Customs or Immigration facility on the US side. The first official facility one encounters is a Mexican government facility right at the physical border. In most areas, it isn't necessary to stop at that location at all, you simply drive on by. The actual Mexican Customs and Immigration buildings are typically located several kilometers further into Mexico. The system is so loosey-goosey that we once took a wrong turn and drove right into, and miles through, the city of Nogales, Sonora, without going through Mexican Customs and Immigration at all. Had we had a trunk full of automatic weapons, no one would have been the wiser.

After we obtained our necessary Customs and Immigration papers at the Mexican border facility, we just continued driving into Mexico. Not once in the 8 or 9 times we've made the trip, has anyone at Mexican Customs bothered to check our vehicle, look in the trunk, etc.

I assume similar conditions exist at the borders between many other countries. It is certainly the case between the USA and Canada as well. So, whose responsibility is it to ensure that weapons are not being smuggled into Mexico, from the United States? Seems to me the burden falls on Mexico, not the USA.

Didn't you ever learn about SHARING? If the problem is Mexican authorities are outgunned because money and weapons are pouring into Mexico from the U.S.A., you just might want to rethink who should be working to stop the flow of weapons into Mexico, especially while you're expecting Mexico to stop the flow of migrants and refugees into the U.S.A.

There are cartels because tens of millions of U.S. consumers want substances banned by their government.

Mexico didn't choose to have a border with a country so full of so many people with so many vices and willing to pay so much for them. But it's a multi-billion dollar a year industry.

U.S. arms dealers are making billions selling firearms to Mexico. Because the U.S. government already knows it has a problem. The U.S.A. sees more of its own people killed by firearms each year than does any other country or than in any armed conflict, and the U.S. federal government is intentionally exporting that very same problem to other countries because it can and because it generates profits paid to its politicians, especially thanks to lobbyists, SuperPACs, and Citizens United. There is a point where greed is excessive, and the greed of the U.S.A. needs to be reigned in, including the greed of its arms manufacturers and dealers.

It's not like the ATF or whatever alphabet agency that has jurisdiction nowadays doesn't know who is selling firearms to whom. They knew where to put marked weapons for Fast & Furious that would get bought and smuggled into Mexico. It's that it's not against U.S. law no matter how unethical or immoral it is. And that's pretty much where a lot of problems begin in the USA. Corruption is entirely legal, so even though it's right before your eyes, you don't see it.

So the U.S. government gets to create a problem (the narco trade), export the War On Drugs to other countries (because it found out wayyyy back in the 70's that the War On Drugs didn't look good when the bodies of its citizens were stacking up on the 5 o'clock news every evening), profit from selling weapons to the organized criminals it creates, ignore the problems it creates in other countries, then not only block refugees fleeing violence in those countries from seeking refuge or asylum in the U.S.A. but also blackmailing Mexico into using its limited resources to stopping the migrants.

Is that really what the Sweet Land of Liberty stands for? How did I and so many others get it so wrong for so many years?

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Sunday, February 09, 2020, 14:47 (48 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Everyone is missing the main point and trying to make this a grand statement about the problems between the US and Mexico. This situation is about a BAD person committing a criminal act. This is a local issue that should demand local law enforcement of the law. Extortion should not be permitted anywhere. Rob you have no idea where this person obtained the gun, it does not matter. The local authorities need to eliminate or at least pursue those that attempt to extort money from the business owners. Don’t blame all the ills of Mexico on the US. I am speaking as a Canadian that believes in upholding the laws.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Sunday, February 09, 2020, 15:00 (48 days ago) @ Zihuagecko

Everyone is missing the main point and trying to make this a grand statement about the problems between the US and Mexico. This situation is about a BAD person committing a criminal act. This is a local issue that should demand local law enforcement of the law. Extortion should not be permitted anywhere. Rob you have no idea where this person obtained the gun, it does not matter. The local authorities need to eliminate or at least pursue those that attempt to extort money from the business owners. Don’t blame all the ills of Mexico on the US. I am speaking as a Canadian that believes in upholding the laws.

Thank you for your contribution, but the concept of "upholding the law" is one thing for you and another for us here. I don't know anyone who wants all our laws enforced. Being laid back and having an attitude of live-and-let-live is part of Mexican culture. We don't have police capable up upholding all or most of the laws because they are outgunned and outspent and untrained to do so. We have an inadequate number of federal and state police unfamiliar with our area who get lucky at some of the roadblocks catching organized criminals driving around with AR-15s and AK-47s, but we also have entire towns that have been abandoned in our region because no government forces can control the region or guarantee public safety. So, we have extortionists who roam unchecked extorting from locals and sowing terror. This is not going to change until our problematic neighbor steps up and makes some significant contribution to the effort so that our police can concentrate on normal law enforcement matters instead of perpetually being disadvantaged in a war they cannot win. Our Presidente also recognizes this. Unfortunately the current U.S. administration will never do the right thing that is needed.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 13:24 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

A little condescending tone, but I will ignore this slight. “For us here” to quote. I live here five months every year for the past twelve years and was a visitor before that. Upholding the law of extortion and murder should be the same for everyone. You included. I also love the laid back approach to life in Mexico but murder is not part of “live-and-let-live attitude of Mexican Culture. There is no excuse for not protecting the public from criminals. You continue to make excuses and blame outside interests. The problems you acknowledge will not change as long as people take this approach. Take responsibility! Unfortunately it is always easier to deflect responsibility and blame others. I don’t have the answers to all the problems we face here in Mexico, but we need to start constructively dealing with corruption and criminal acts. especially extortion and murder. Just as an aside I doubt this murderer uses an AK-15 or 47, probably a pistol and probably not from the US - just saying.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, February 10, 2020, 14:14 (47 days ago) @ Zihuagecko

A little condescending tone, but I will ignore this slight. “For us here” to quote. I live here five months every year for the past twelve years and was a visitor before that. Upholding the law of extortion and murder should be the same for everyone. You included. I also love the laid back approach to life in Mexico but murder is not part of “live-and-let-live attitude of Mexican Culture. There is no excuse for not protecting the public from criminals. You continue to make excuses and blame outside interests. The problems you acknowledge will not change as long as people take this approach. Take responsibility! Unfortunately it is always easier to deflect responsibility and blame others. I don’t have the answers to all the problems we face here in Mexico, but we need to start constructively dealing with corruption and criminal acts. especially extortion and murder. Just as an aside I doubt this murderer uses an AK-15 or 47, probably a pistol and probably not from the US - just saying.

Bueno, ya que vives aquí tanto, mejor comuniquemos en el idioma local.

De nuevo, estás aplicando criterios ajenos a nuestros problemas locales. Insistes en ver las cosas desde tu punto de vista, un punto afinado en otra tierra y en otra cultura. Si tuviéramos la policía de tu tierra podríamos esperar los resultados que esperas.

No, no hay pretexto por no proteger al público de los criminales, con la excepción de todas las razones que ya te dije pero que no te gustan. Sólo te puedo sugerir que te ubiques. Que te des cuenta dónde estás. Si la policía de acá intentan operar como tu policía de allá, terminan muertos. Nuestra realidad es muy distinta de la realidad de donde vienes y de donde vives los otros meses del año.

El pistolero no tiene que haber usado un cuerno de chivo para poder beneficiarse de la ola de armas que inunden México desde los EE.UU. El daño ya está hecho. Las fuerzas policiacas que tenemos ya están superadas y no pueden contra los grupos delictivos. Por esta razón el presidente de México no está llevando a cabo el deseo de los gringos de tener una "guerra contra el narco." No vamos a seguir repitiendo los errores del pasado en este aspecto, y él está tratando de usar otros métodos. Una vez que México no esté sufriendo los estragos de la política fallida de los EE.UU. contra el narco, quizás podremos tener una policía capaz de combatir la criminalidad al nivel local. Pero por el momento nuestras policías municipales sólo son conocidos por sus propias habilidades de extorsionar, robar y golpear a sus detenidos. No para investigar, atrapar y encarcelar. No creo que hay comunidad mexicana que tiene policías así.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:37 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Se dice que ve a personas tan dispuestas a aceptar la extorsion y el asesinato como de costumbre. Ojala algun dia eso cambie.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:54 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Entiendo algunos de sus puntos, pero aun no puedo aceptar que esto sea normal

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by jay @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 16:54 (47 days ago) @ Zihuagecko

There is no excuse for not protecting the public from criminals.

Let's do a little thought experiment. You're a police officer in Mexico sworn to protect the public. One day you're approached by a narco. "Here. Take this bribe or we'll torture and kill you and your family." Do you channel your inner John Wayne and tell him to go to hell? Or, like most everybody, do you take the bribe and look the other way?

You want to live in the real world? That's the real world.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Ironwood @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 16:58 (47 days ago) @ jay

There is no excuse for not protecting the public from criminals.

Let's do a little thought experiment. You're a police officer in Mexico sworn to protect the public. One day you're approached by a narco. "Here. Take this bribe or we'll torture and kill you and your family." Do you channel your inner John Wayne and tell him to go to hell? Or, like most everybody, do you take the bribe and look the other way?

You want to live in the real world? That's the real world.

Plata o plomo

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:52 (47 days ago) @ Ironwood

Take the Silver and live a good life .

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Swimming for one's life

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, February 10, 2020, 18:30 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Take the Silver and live a good life .

Or run for your life to the USA or Canada, if you can get across the border. Now the gringos make you wait forever, giving the bad guys plenty of time to hunt you down because it's something they can do and it's a matter of principle, so that's why folks swim the Río Bravo with their babies. The same principle that caused someone to shoot the vendors in Ixtapa. Reputation and perception are everything in the extorsion business.

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Swimming for one's life

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 18:42 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Take the Silver and live a good life .


Or run for your life to the USA or Canada, if you can get across the border. Now the gringos make you wait forever, giving the bad guys plenty of time to hunt you down because it's something they can do and it's a matter of principle, so that's why folks swim the Río Bravo with their babies. The same principle that caused someone to shoot the vendors in Ixtapa. Reputation and perception are everything in the extorsion business.

They made their point didn't they ?

Supply and Demand

by h4Dan, California, Monday, February 10, 2020, 15:50 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

In one hand we have USA customers buying narcotics supplied by Mexicans

Result = Bad USA for buying narcotics

On the other hand we have Mexican customers buying weapons supplied by the USA

Result = Bad USA for supplying weapons

I'm beginning to see a pattern here

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by islandgirl @, Cowichan Valley, Saturday, February 08, 2020, 22:40 (49 days ago) @ Ironwood

I think ease of crossing the US/Canada border depends on who you are, or more to the point what you look like. Crossing at Blaine, (actually to meet a friend from Zihua with donations to take back) my young son and I were hauled into a huge line up inside, while our vehicle & belongings were searched. As we stood in the line up I looked around and said to my son, hmmm, doesn't seem to be anyone with blond hair or blue eyes in this line up. Nope, not a one.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 10:51 (48 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Yea---always easier to blame someone else or something else.


Actually, it seems much easier for certain gringos to simply ignore the matter. Too many U.S. citizens want to take zero responsibility for the nefarious actions of their government, its reprehensible policies or the incredible damage caused around the world in the name of We The People. Only its patriots want to own up to and attend to such problems and to do better.

Global arms trade is a nearly 200 billion business and the US drives nearly 80% of it

You know Rob, you seem to have a real chip on your shoulder for the USA. You blame every stubbed toe on the The USA and Donald Trump. My First visit to Zihu was in 1980, it was a lawless crime infested cartel run fishing village then. Not much has changed except some boom and bust cycles that lured more westerners to invest and then be scared out.

There comes a point when your bias is so strong it blinds you to reality. This place where I visit and you live is in the heart of Narco Controlled everything, from the government to the police to almost every business in town . You claim that since you live there year round you know so much more than everyone else. You are either blind to the reality or just plain ignorant.

At some point, and I don't see it anywhere in the near future, The Mexicans are responsible for their own future, and ex pats who dropped out of society long ago to hide in a third world country aren't likely to be of much benefit.

I keep my mouth and thoughts shut becuase you own this board and with the risk of being thrown off I submit this post.

As For me and my Casa. We are heavily armed, I will not be calling the police, or the marines for help, I learned many years ago the law in Mexico and especially Guerrero and Sinaloa the police favors the living.

No Offence, Best Regards

Peter

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Quadra Paul @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 12:03 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Casa Juan @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 13:09 (47 days ago) @ Quadra Paul

Allowing the expression of divergent opinions on issues of public concern is what puts this web site above the feel good web site on facebook about Zihua.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Chas, Monday, February 10, 2020, 13:25 (47 days ago) @ Quadra Paul

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!

Why do feel that anyone who disagrees with you should be silenced/banned. Wouldn’t it be better just to explain why you think he is wrong. The US/Canadian border is over twice as long as the US/Mexican border. If the main problem in Mexico is US policy then Canada should be awash in drug cartels, violence, extortion and lawlessness.
I truly hope somehow this situation can be rectified. My wife and myself have been vacationing here for 15 years and these types of events are very disturbing. When we heard the news we were especially saddened because we were in Ixtapa the week before this happened. We stopped at that kiosk and bought a battery powered dragon from this family. The father, mother and the kids were all involved and were laughing, chatting and having a good time. It’s heart breaking to think that their lives could be destroyed by some sick individuals for 400 pesos.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 14:41 (47 days ago) @ Chas

Chas this is the crux of this thread that most followers are missing. This type of behaviour must be condemned and those guilty punished. I don’t want to hear a tirade of excuses blaming a foreign country to the north. No excuses for the authorities responsible for our protection. Or do we all need to arm ourselves because law enforcement is to intimidate to do their job.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, February 10, 2020, 16:03 (47 days ago) @ Chas

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!


Why do feel that anyone who disagrees with you should be silenced/banned. Wouldn’t it be better just to explain why you think he is wrong. The US/Canadian border is over twice as long as the US/Mexican border. If the main problem in Mexico is US policy then Canada should be awash in drug cartels, violence, extortion and lawlessness.
I truly hope somehow this situation can be rectified. My wife and myself have been vacationing here for 15 years and these types of events are very disturbing. When we heard the news we were especially saddened because we were in Ixtapa the week before this happened. We stopped at that kiosk and bought a battery powered dragon from this family. The father, mother and the kids were all involved and were laughing, chatting and having a good time. It’s heart breaking to think that their lives could be destroyed by some sick individuals for 400 pesos.

But Canada is mostly Anglo with some French for good measure. All acceptable pigments. Mexico had the good fortune, like Canada, of helping supply the USA with alcohol during Prohibition 1.0, and that wasn’t considered very problematic. We were also able, thanks to our climate, to supply gringos with the cannabis they sought. But when the DEA attacked Mexico’s cannabis industry at the same time it literally handed a few unscrupulous Mexican capos Colombia’s cocaine industry, it created a new beast. The increase in opium addiction thanks to U.S. doctors getting tens of thousands of people addicted to opioids also stimulated Mexico’s opium industry, which is in the process of being replaced by Chinese-manufactured fentanyl. The same people who also supply the USA’s meth heads. The Chinese are using Mexico for geopolitical reasons so that you blame Mexico, not China.

The entire narco problem is a self-inflicted wound by the USA, but it’s prejudice against Latinos is very real.

Major drug supply change in Zihua

by cd69 @, Winnipeg,MB,Canada, Monday, February 17, 2020, 00:36 (41 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Rob, one thing I find scary about the drug scene in Zihua is the fact the two cartels fighting for power are not bringing coke for local sale but meth. It is actually not easy to find any quality cocaine in town as the cartels want to push meth sales. Coming from a place going through a meth crisis I find this not good news.

Major drug supply change in Zihua

by allen @, Pacific Northwest, Monday, February 17, 2020, 02:01 (41 days ago) @ cd69

It has been that way for many years. Nothing new.

Major drug supply change in Zihua

by cd69 @, Winnipeg,MB,Canada, Monday, February 17, 2020, 02:13 (41 days ago) @ allen

Certainly not according to local friends that are in that scene

Major drug supply change in Zihua

by allen @, Pacific Northwest, Monday, February 17, 2020, 02:42 (41 days ago) @ cd69

Well, at the cost of potentially exposing myself, I have only seen real cocaine once is the last 20 years. It is always at least cut with or purely amphetamines. I think that it is so pervasive that no one locally even knows the difference any more. It actually really irritates me as crack is overly abundant and it takes pure coke to make crack.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by jay @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:13 (47 days ago) @ Chas

If the main problem in Mexico is US policy then Canada should be awash in drug cartels, violence, extortion and lawlessness.

Simplistic thinking.
1. Poverty is a root cause of most of these problems. Mexico is mostly a third-world country, awash in poverty. Canada is a first-world affluent country.
2. Mexico's climate is ideal for growing coca, the cartel drug of choice. Canada's climate is not.
3. Canada has first-world law-enforcement and judicial systems. Mexico does not.
4. Canadian farmers can make a good living growing legal crops. Many Mexican farmers cannot.

I'm sure there are many other reasons. Canada is not awash in these problems for the same reasons most other first-world countries are not. Mexico's problems, on the other hand, are similar to those of many other third-world countries. Can you not see the difference?

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:51 (47 days ago) @ jay

If the main problem in Mexico is US policy then Canada should be awash in drug cartels, violence, extortion and lawlessness.

Simplistic thinking.
1. Poverty is a root cause of most of these problems. Mexico is mostly a third-world country, awash in poverty. Canada is a first-world affluent country.
2. Mexico's climate is ideal for growing coca, the cartel drug of choice. Canada's climate is not.
3. Canada has first-world law-enforcement and judicial systems. Mexico does not.
4. Canadian farmers can make a good living growing legal crops. Many Mexican farmers cannot.

I'm sure there are many other reasons. Canada is not awash in these problems for the same reasons most other first-world countries are not. Mexico's problems, on the other hand, are similar to those of many other third-world countries. Can you not see the difference?

Very Little Coca is grown in Mexico, they have been trying to establish it in the southern tip and it has produced poor results. Less than 1 % of the Coca is grown in Mexico, it takes years to establish a Coca plant, in 6 months a pot plant is grown and finished. If the Marines tear up a pot feild it is replanted in months. They tear up Coca plants and years of work has been lost.

Gunshots in Ixtapa THIS

by midalake @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 19:35 (47 days ago) @ Chas

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!


Why do feel that anyone who disagrees with you should be silenced/banned. Wouldn’t it be better just to explain why you think he is wrong. The US/Canadian border is over twice as long as the US/Mexican border. If the main problem in Mexico is US policy then Canada should be awash in drug cartels, violence, extortion and lawlessness.
I truly hope somehow this situation can be rectified. My wife and myself have been vacationing here for 15 years and these types of events are very disturbing. When we heard the news we were especially saddened because we were in Ixtapa the week before this happened. We stopped at that kiosk and bought a battery powered dragon from this family. The father, mother and the kids were all involved and were laughing, chatting and having a good time. It’s heart breaking to think that their lives could be destroyed by some sick individuals for 400 pesos.

THIS......THIS.....

D

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Quadra Paul @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 22:21 (47 days ago) @ Chas

I have given up trying to reason with this guy. The "heavily armed" comment ought to tell you something!

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 18:33 (47 days ago) @ Quadra Paul

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMD5z6kGjnA


This is the Reality Paul

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Ironwood @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 21:29 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMD5z6kGjnA


This is the Reality Paul

We could make a good start on combating the crass, the crude and the crap in society by shooting whoever performs the soundtrack to your video. THAT would be progress!

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 21:38 (47 days ago) @ Ironwood

No Offence? Best Regards? You have got to be kidding! Rob, please do us all a favour and give this guy the hook!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMD5z6kGjnA


This is the Reality Paul


We could make a good start on combating the crass, the crude and the crap in society by shooting whoever performs the soundtrack to your video. THAT would be progress!

The Music fit the place I was filming wouldnt you say, crime drugs and so forth ?

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Quadra Paul @, Monday, February 10, 2020, 22:29 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

What? The Parthenon is reality? Maybe yours!

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 13:29 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

I agree you your comments. Not sure why Quadra Paul wants to de-platform you. Afraid of open dialogue?

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Rogerthat, Monday, February 10, 2020, 13:30 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Well said unknown white boy. Exactly why my non criminal MX amigos have weapons to defend their families and why this liberal gringo arms himself when in the EU.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, February 10, 2020, 14:34 (47 days ago) @ Rogerthat

Well said unknown white boy. Exactly why my non criminal MX amigos have weapons to defend their families and why this liberal gringo arms himself when in the EU.

You arm yourself in the European Union aka EU? Or did you mean to use the Spanish abbreviation for the USA? EE.UU.

Mexicans are allowed to own firearms to protect their homes. They just aren't allowed to have military-style weapons.

A shame that so many folks can't be objective about the USA but instead lash out at anyone who criticizes what are its well known shortcomings, labeling any such person a U.S. basher or whatever. You not only miss the point, you lose yourself behind your own bias. Plenty of good points about the USA, but it is far from what its own citizens believe it is, far from the country you are taught about in school. I know you want to see the USA as Ronnie Raygun described it. That shining city on a hill. But most of the world (including this born'n'bred Southerner) knows better. The USA was largely built on genocide, slavery, land theft, and wars based on lies. But far from being humble and having learned its lessons and bettered itself from its past mistakes, currently the USA is doubling down on "American Exceptionalism" with a draft-dodging criminal in the White House who gets to have honest subordinates in uniform fired, humiliated and frog-marched out for being patriots and doing their sworn duties with patriotism and professionalism. So are spineless Republican lawmakers also going to defend him now for violating the law regarding retribution against witnesses? My goodness, man, the U.S. government still can't even treat the indigenous people with the respect they deserve.

So I just don't see the moral justification for your criticism of me. I'm just the messenger.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 14:50 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I am very interested in the first part of your comments. Where can I find information on Mexician’s being able to own firearms, I assume this refers to handguns and small caliber rifles.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Scott, Playa del Carmen, Quintana Roo, Mexico, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:44 (47 days ago) @ Zihuagecko

It's a constitutional right. Article 10.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Zihuagecko, Monday, February 10, 2020, 17:59 (47 days ago) @ Scott

thanks, got the article 10

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Art. 10

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, February 10, 2020, 18:20 (47 days ago) @ Zihuagecko

thanks, got the article 10

Unlike the USA's 2nd Amendment, Artículo 10 has been reformado since its original writing.

Artículo 10. Los habitantes de los Estados Unidos Mexicanos tienen derecho a poseer armas en su domicilio, para su seguridad y legítima defensa, con excepción de las prohibidas por la Ley Federal y de las reservadas para el uso exclusivo del Ejército, Armada, Fuerza Aérea y Guardia Nacional. La ley federal determinará los casos, condiciones, requisitos y lugares en que se podrá autorizar a los habitantes la portación de armas.
Artículo reformado DOF 22-10-1971

I wonder why there was really no big deal about modifying this law in Mexico at the time? Could it be because we have no NRA? No lobbyists? No SuperPAC's? No Citizens United? No arms manufacturers?

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, February 10, 2020, 23:20 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Yea---always easier to blame someone else or something else.


Actually, it seems much easier for certain gringos to simply ignore the matter. Too many U.S. citizens want to take zero responsibility for the nefarious actions of their government, its reprehensible policies or the incredible damage caused around the world in the name of We The People. Only its patriots want to own up to and attend to such problems and to do better.

Global arms trade is a nearly 200 billion business and the US drives nearly 80% of it


You know Rob, you seem to have a real chip on your shoulder for the USA. You blame every stubbed toe on the The USA and Donald Trump. My First visit to Zihu was in 1980, it was a lawless crime infested cartel run fishing village then. Not much has changed except some boom and bust cycles that lured more westerners to invest and then be scared out.

There comes a point when your bias is so strong it blinds you to reality. This place where I visit and you live is in the heart of Narco Controlled everything, from the government to the police to almost every business in town . You claim that since you live there year round you know so much more than everyone else. You are either blind to the reality or just plain ignorant.

At some point, and I don't see it anywhere in the near future, The Mexicans are responsible for their own future, and ex pats who dropped out of society long ago to hide in a third world country aren't likely to be of much benefit.

I keep my mouth and thoughts shut becuase you own this board and with the risk of being thrown off I submit this post.

As For me and my Casa. We are heavily armed, I will not be calling the police, or the marines for help, I learned many years ago the law in Mexico and especially Guerrero and Sinaloa the police favors the living.

No Offence, Best Regards

Peter

No offense. You didn’t really know Zihuatanejo in 1980 and you appear to know even less about it today. With all our problems it remains an oasis and a sanctuary in a world gone mad. In Chilapa children are being trained to fight criminals. In Vallecitos everyone has abandoned the town. In Cocula they buried two children today attacked and murdered by criminals over the weekend. In Zihuatanejo children go to school normally and play in the plazas, playgrounds and on the beaches. There is nothing here for narcos but gasoline for their vessels as they pass by at sea. We have no major market or transit points. Lázaro is a transit point, but mostly for receiving drugs from China including precursors for making meth. The narcos are fighting over control of Tierra Caliente for its isolation yet fairly easy access to cities like Morelia, Uruapan, Guadalajara, Guanajuato and CDMX. The extortionists in Zihuatanejo are just punks. But since we don’t have a functioning police force they feel emboldened. Thus my insistence that the solution to our problem depends upon the USA being a part of the solution instead of continuing to be a source of the problem.

El Negro Durazo wasn’t a narco. He thought he was a superhero. He threatened my wife’s family. I don’t recommend touring his monument to corruption or giving it any publicity. I’d just as soon see it razed and the land sold to reimburse families like my wife’s who suffered losses at the hands of El Negro Durazo.

As a foreigner you are not permitted to have firearms, so you may be in violation of the law

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Monday, February 10, 2020, 23:55 (47 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Yea---always easier to blame someone else or something else.


Actually, it seems much easier for certain gringos to simply ignore the matter. Too many U.S. citizens want to take zero responsibility for the nefarious actions of their government, its reprehensible policies or the incredible damage caused around the world in the name of We The People. Only its patriots want to own up to and attend to such problems and to do better.

Global arms trade is a nearly 200 billion business and the US drives nearly 80% of it


You know Rob, you seem to have a real chip on your shoulder for the USA. You blame every stubbed toe on the The USA and Donald Trump. My First visit to Zihu was in 1980, it was a lawless crime infested cartel run fishing village then. Not much has changed except some boom and bust cycles that lured more westerners to invest and then be scared out.

There comes a point when your bias is so strong it blinds you to reality. This place where I visit and you live is in the heart of Narco Controlled everything, from the government to the police to almost every business in town . You claim that since you live there year round you know so much more than everyone else. You are either blind to the reality or just plain ignorant.

At some point, and I don't see it anywhere in the near future, The Mexicans are responsible for their own future, and ex pats who dropped out of society long ago to hide in a third world country aren't likely to be of much benefit.

I keep my mouth and thoughts shut becuase you own this board and with the risk of being thrown off I submit this post.

As For me and my Casa. We are heavily armed, I will not be calling the police, or the marines for help, I learned many years ago the law in Mexico and especially Guerrero and Sinaloa the police favors the living.

No Offence, Best Regards

Peter


No offense. You didn’t really know Zihuatanejo in 1980 and you appear to know even less about it today. With all our problems it remains an oasis and a sanctuary in a world gone mad. In Chilapa children are being trained to fight criminals. In Vallecitos everyone has abandoned the town. In Cocula they buried two children today attacked and murdered by criminals over the weekend. In Zihuatanejo children go to school normally and play in the plazas, playgrounds and on the beaches. There is nothing here for narcos but gasoline for their vessels as they pass by at sea. We have no major market or transit points. Lázaro is a transit point, but mostly for receiving drugs from China including precursors for making meth. The narcos are fighting over control of Tierra Caliente for its isolation yet fairly easy access to cities like Morelia, Uruapan, Guadalajara, Guanajuato and CDMX. The extortionists in Zihuatanejo are just punks. But since we don’t have a functioning police force they feel emboldened. Thus my insistence that the solution to our problem depends upon the USA being a part of the solution instead of continuing to be a source of the problem.

El Negro Durazo wasn’t a narco. He thought he was a superhero. He threatened my wife’s family. I don’t recommend touring his monument to corruption or giving it any publicity. I’d just as soon see it razed and the land sold to reimburse families like my wife’s who suffered losses at the hands of El Negro Durazo.

As a foreigner you are not permitted to have firearms, so you may be in violation of the law

I agree with 95 % of that post Rob, we do have common ground.

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The 95% solution

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 08:24 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete

I agree with 95 % of that post Rob, we do have common ground.

:deadhorse:
Perfect, 'cause I'm still leaving stuff out that doesn't need to be discussed on a public forum.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Ironwood @, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 09:02 (47 days ago) @ Canada Pete


I agree with 95 % of that post Rob, we do have common ground.

You're a tad inconsistent, Pete. Rob refutes just about everything you said about Zihua in 1980 and Zihua today.....and you agree with 95% of what he says?

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 11:06 (47 days ago) @ Ironwood

Mr Ironwood,

I gave my opinion and my view, I dont have a need to shove it down anyones throat or convince anyone I am right or wrong.

Enough has been said already in this public forum. Neither I or anyone else wishes to be looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board.

For the folks that are coming here and visit infrequently I hope this thread did not make them worry.

This is a wonderful place, magical in many aspects, it is safe for you, your family, you children and your friends, it is extremely RARE for tourists to run in to problems here. The people are friendly and at you service to visit their home and to show you the beauty that is here.

With that said, it is also heartbreaking to watch locals suffer with a lack of government support.

Best Regards,

Avatar

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by mosesk @, Ojai, CA, USA, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 11:42 (46 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Mr Ironwood,

I gave my opinion and my view, I dont have a need to shove it down anyones throat or convince anyone I am right or wrong.

Enough has been said already in this public forum. Neither I or anyone else wishes to be looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board.

For the folks that are coming here and visit infrequently I hope this thread did not make them worry.

This is a wonderful place, magical in many aspects, it is safe for you, your family, you children and your friends, it is extremely RARE for tourists to run in to problems here. The people are friendly and at you service to visit their home and to show you the beauty that is here.

With that said, it is also heartbreaking to watch locals suffer with a lack of government support.

Best Regards,

Your comment makes some sense.
However the "looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board" throws me overboard.
Is this an inside joke?

Avatar

Paddleboard fears

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 12:14 (46 days ago) @ mosesk

Mr Ironwood,

I gave my opinion and my view, I dont have a need to shove it down anyones throat or convince anyone I am right or wrong.

Enough has been said already in this public forum. Neither I or anyone else wishes to be looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board.

For the folks that are coming here and visit infrequently I hope this thread did not make them worry.

This is a wonderful place, magical in many aspects, it is safe for you, your family, you children and your friends, it is extremely RARE for tourists to run in to problems here. The people are friendly and at you service to visit their home and to show you the beauty that is here.

With that said, it is also heartbreaking to watch locals suffer with a lack of government support.

Best Regards,


Your comment makes some sense.
However the "looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board" throws me overboard.
Is this an inside joke?

Many of the folks who careen around the bay on wave runners are scary smiling demons who will ride right into you.

Avatar

Paddleboard fears

by mosesk @, Ojai, CA, USA, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 12:23 (46 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Mr Ironwood,

I gave my opinion and my view, I dont have a need to shove it down anyones throat or convince anyone I am right or wrong.

Enough has been said already in this public forum. Neither I or anyone else wishes to be looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board.

For the folks that are coming here and visit infrequently I hope this thread did not make them worry.

This is a wonderful place, magical in many aspects, it is safe for you, your family, you children and your friends, it is extremely RARE for tourists to run in to problems here. The people are friendly and at you service to visit their home and to show you the beauty that is here.

With that said, it is also heartbreaking to watch locals suffer with a lack of government support.

Best Regards,


Your comment makes some sense.
However the "looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board" throws me overboard.
Is this an inside joke?


Many of the folks who careen around the bay on wave runners are scary smiling demons who will ride right into you.


Ah, I'm not fond of wave runners either, whether sober, drunk or stoned...
I thought you might be telling me something about Talley Ho I didn't know...;-) e

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Paddleboard fears

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 12:34 (46 days ago) @ mosesk

Your comment makes some sense.
However the "looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board" throws me overboard.
Is this an inside joke?


Many of the folks who careen around the bay on wave runners are scary smiling demons who will ride right into you.

Ah, I'm not fond of wave runners either, whether sober, drunk or stoned...
I thought you might be telling me something about Talley Ho I didn't know...;-) e

If you're paddling about the bay and see Talley Ho and company and suddenly from nowhere this song reaches your ears, you may be in trouble.


https://youtu.be/mJag19WoAe0

Paddleboard fears

by ZihuaRx @, Friday, February 14, 2020, 16:41 (43 days ago) @ mosesk

Those two do seem to smile a lot......

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Ironwood @, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 15:09 (46 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Mr Ironwood,

I gave my opinion and my view, I dont have a need to shove it down anyones throat or convince anyone I am right or wrong.

Enough has been said already in this public forum. Neither I or anyone else wishes to be looking over their backs while intoxicated on a paddle board.

For the folks that are coming here and visit infrequently I hope this thread did not make them worry.

This is a wonderful place, magical in many aspects, it is safe for you, your family, you children and your friends, it is extremely RARE for tourists to run in to problems here. The people are friendly and at you service to visit their home and to show you the beauty that is here.

With that said, it is also heartbreaking to watch locals suffer with a lack of government support.

Best Regards,

It's Mrs.

Durazo

by Skink, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 16:34 (46 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I just read about this guy in Wiki.....my goodness!...shite

Law & Order - a lighter side

by Ironwood @, Tuesday, February 11, 2020, 16:58 (46 days ago) @ Skink

A Quebec couple recently discovered a live frog inside a green pepper they'd purchased at a local grocery. They reported their discovery to the provincial Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries & Food, but since the pepper is imported, the frog's file has been transferred to the federal Canada Food Inspection Agency.
No word on whether the grocer is demanding a premium price for "Pepper with Frog".


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/saguenay-couple-finds-live-frog-in-green-pepper-1.5458342

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by La Reina ⌂ @, Wednesday, February 12, 2020, 11:39 (45 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I completely agree with your advice not to visit the so-called parthenon. As you suggested, it simply glorifies an evil person. I, too, think it should be destroyed, with the vacant land them being used for something to benefit the local community.

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Gunshots in Ixtapa

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Wednesday, February 12, 2020, 14:56 (45 days ago) @ La Reina

Like the original Parthenon, or The Pyramids ?

The Parthenon is part of Guerrero's and Zihu's history, first time I came there, the Parthenon was the only thing on that side of the bay. Everything else you see came after.

Now if you really wanna see something , check out Guzman Bay. But I wouldn't recommend it just yet.

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Symbols

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Wednesday, February 12, 2020, 17:46 (45 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Like the original Parthenon, or The Pyramids ?

The Parthenon is part of Guerrero's and Zihu's history, first time I came there, the Parthenon was the only thing on that side of the bay. Everything else you see came after.

Now if you really wanna see something , check out Guzman Bay. But I wouldn't recommend it just yet.

A shame that someone else's pain and suffering (remember we're not talking ancient history here, victims are still alive today including my family) is only seen as a tourist attraction to explore. Sometimes it's not easy living in a tourist destination.

Personally I've never set foot on that property and I have no intention of ever doing so.

Perhaps it isn't a good idea to glorify symbols of corruption, treachery and cruelty.

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Symbols

by Fran @, Evanston, IL, Thursday, February 13, 2020, 09:11 (45 days ago) @ ZihuaRob


Personally I've never set foot on that property and I have no intention of ever doing so.

Perhaps it isn't a good idea to glorify symbols of corruption, treachery and cruelty.


I went up to see the place. I didn’t get the impression that it glorified anything. To me, it was a graphic and gaudy display of excess and corruption. Complete with its dated dishwasher and scummy reflecting pool and overgrown helicopter landing pad. All it needs is a plaque to remind everyone how the story ends.

I think it should be left there as is as a reminder. Human nature is corruptible. Crime doesn’t pay. Abuse of power generally ends badly for the abuser.

I had heard there was talk about restoring it as an art school for children. If people don’t want it left there that sounded good to me as a project.

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Symbols

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Thursday, February 13, 2020, 12:52 (44 days ago) @ Fran


Personally I've never set foot on that property and I have no intention of ever doing so.

Perhaps it isn't a good idea to glorify symbols of corruption, treachery and cruelty.

I went up to see the place. I didn’t get the impression that it glorified anything. To me, it was a graphic and gaudy display of excess and corruption. Complete with its dated dishwasher and scummy reflecting pool and overgrown helicopter landing pad. All it needs is a plaque to remind everyone how the story ends.

I think it should be left there as is as a reminder. Human nature is corruptible. Crime doesn’t pay. Abuse of power generally ends badly for the abuser.

I had heard there was talk about restoring it as an art school for children. If people don’t want it left there that sounded good to me as a project.

I agree completley , I don't view it for anything more than it is, corruption, excess and how it always ends. For all of these folks there are only two outcomes, prison or death. No one ever retires in peace from that life.

Symbols

by Quadra Paul @, Thursday, February 13, 2020, 19:22 (44 days ago) @ Canada Pete

Tell that to the carrot headed guy in the White House!

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Symbols

by Canada Pete @, Vancouver Island / San Jose / Houston, Friday, February 14, 2020, 15:18 (43 days ago) @ Quadra Paul

Tell that to the carrot headed guy in the White House!

I'm not sure he has any effect on Quadra Island, this summer the govt dock was in shambles and looked like the same junkyard of abandoned crap from the coal burners that live there.

Worry about yourself and the problems next door instead of what doesn't affect you thousands of miles away, you'll get more done and be less stressed.

Regards

Symbols

by Quadra Paul @, Friday, February 14, 2020, 18:25 (43 days ago) @ Canada Pete

In fact he does have an effect on all Canadians. I don't know where you've been for the last three years, but you sure haven't been paying attention! As for Quadra Island, it's pretty obvious you don't know dick about the place and that suits me just fine! Coal burners on the dock? What an asshole you are! Do all of us on Quadra a favour and don't come back! And while you're at it, move back to that open pit province that you can see from space!

My apologies to everyone else who has to read this response to a really rude and uninformed person. I would have replied to him privately, but he hasn't even figured that out.

Gunshots in Ixtapa

by rdcosta @, Thursday, February 13, 2020, 18:49 (44 days ago) @ La Reina

too bad you feel that way, but it could be an excellent tourist attraction for Zihua and the money from it could be channeled into paying the people that lost out
demolishing it would be a loss for the area, it is a part of history now