bad news out of Guerrero

by Oeste Hermoso @, Zihuatanejo, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 12:06 (4222 days ago)

no wonder Rob doesn't want me driving that route from the DF to Zihua. What's with radical teachers 2B?
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/mexican-police-discover-mass-grave-amid-search-for-missing-students-1.2788044

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bad news out of Guerrero

by Linda from Canada @, Zihua and Grand Marais, Manitoba, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 15:42 (4222 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

These photos are not exactly of the cuota, where you would presumably be travelling. Many people, including us, travel this route often without any problems whatsoever. Put it this way....what would you leave the trans-Canada and head off into the bush?

--
Linda from Canada
check out my books at www.livingthedreaminmexico.com AND please have a look at www.cookingwithclaudiainzihuatanejo.blogspot.com as well as www.albertoinzihuatanejo.blogspot.com

bad news out of Guerrero

by katherine @, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 16:28 (4222 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

As a Gringo, you are far safer in Mexico than a Mexican. Provided you don't do anything foolish. Like driving off into the unknown, on back roads.

bad news out of Guerrero

by Paulf @, Mount Sterling, Ky 40353, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 16:53 (4222 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

A couple of years ago the students closed the highway between Morelia and Patzquaro and burned busses and police cars. We had done a tour of the villages in the morning and when returning in the evening to Morelia they had blocked both directions of traffic and were intimidating you for donations to get by. The police was at the both ends of the students but were doing nothing. Our driver was afraid not to make a donation.

bad news out of Guerrero

by Jo in Vancouver, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 18:46 (4221 days ago) @ Paulf

We drove through the cuoata one year ( about 2012?) when the local people had closed and blockaded the pay stations. They explained it was in regard to broken promises about paying tolls for getting to the small side villages affected by the cuota ..we gave them to toll instead..happened in at least 3 of the pay stations. They were polite and we didn't feel obligated to pay them. No violence or burning buses though. I think it is safer being a tourist than being a local...and we don't drive at night or on bush roads.

bad news out of Guerrero

by Paulf @, Mount Sterling, Ky 40353, Monday, October 06, 2014, 08:20 (4221 days ago) @ Jo in Vancouver

This was when the students were rioting over the government changing the college requirement to graduate. Like in the States getting a liberal arts degree. So many were studying dead native languages and there were no need for that degree. In Morelia college is free but at the same time you had all the students graduating with no job potential. The blockade was by students and the teachers union which is very strong in Morelia was supporting the students. It was unbelievable the number of empty buses parked along the highway that had brought in protesters to block both directions of traffic and the Federal Police doing nothing- Morelia was a mess in 2012 with tents set up in parks and open areas with armored police both walking and in trucks all over the place. Certain ATM's were shut down for we had to go to a different area of town for money.

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bad news out of Guerrero

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, October 06, 2014, 08:32 (4221 days ago) @ Paulf

This was when the students were rioting over the government changing the college requirement to graduate. Like in the States getting a liberal arts degree. So many were studying dead native languages and there were no need for that degree.

Paul, that's not quite right. The students did NOT want to learn English but instead wanted to continue studying Nahuatl and Purépecha which are nowhere near being "dead" languages as some descendents of pure Spanish blood would like for them to be.

bad news out of Guerrero

by Paulf @, Mount Sterling, Ky 40353, Monday, October 06, 2014, 09:19 (4221 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I did not mean to imply anything about English. Our friend told us that too many students were studying the languages wanting to be teachers and you know the corruption in trying to become a teacher in Mexico. You have all these students graduating with a degree in languages and no job potential. We have the same problem in the States with the Liberal Arts degrees and the college debt. When my son and daughter-in-law graduated they were over $100,000 in debt. He got a law degree and she a nursing degree from the University of Iowa- at least they are able to pay their debt off for he is a FBI agent in Chicago and she is a part time nurse in a OB ward at a hospital in the Chicago area.

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bad news out of Guerrero

by dhunsber @, ¡Dondequiera que voy, estoy aquí!, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 19:55 (4221 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

What's with radical teachers 2B?

Excuse me? Regardless of what differing mindsets may believe about these students' perceived grievances, it seems that it's the police who are demonstrating radical behavior in skilling at least 6 students and disappearing some 40 or more others. Apparently no police were killed or suffered bullet wounds in the incident.

Student Radicals

by Oeste Hermoso @, Zihuatanejo, Monday, October 06, 2014, 13:23 (4221 days ago) @ dhunsber

I was not implying the students were to blame for what happened. I would just like to know their grievances. Other posters have helped in that regard. As for the pohleese and gangs allegedly involved, I wouldn't dignify the word 'radical' by applying it to them.

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Student Radicals

by dhunsber @, ¡Dondequiera que voy, estoy aquí!, Wednesday, October 08, 2014, 09:30 (4219 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

I was not implying the students were to blame for what happened. I would just like to know their grievances. Other posters have helped in that regard. As for the pohleese and gangs allegedly involved, I wouldn't dignify the word 'radical' by applying it to them.

:megusta:

¡Gracias!

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Greivences and a little background of Ayotzinapa

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Wednesday, October 08, 2014, 10:15 (4219 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

I can't speak to all their grievances, but among them have been demands for guaranteed immediate placement as teachers upon graduation and refusal to be subjected to competency testing. Their most frequent and recurring demands for way too many years for which they repeatedly close highways and extort or ask for money from drivers have been for more money and better services for their school including better meal plans. They commonly steal buses and vehicles to transport themselves to their protests, although in the most recent episode in Iguala I believe they were allowed to contract buses (I don't know if they actually paid anything) in exchange for promising not to harm the buses or their drivers.

These schools, known as "normales rurales", were established during the presidency of Lázaro Cárdenas (1936-1940). There were originally 36 of these schools established around the country. Today I believe only 16 of them remain in operation, 9 here in the state of Guerrero, including the Escuela Normal Rural "Raúl Isidro Burgos" de Ayotzinapa. The schools select their students from among the indigenous populations of the region, the most important requirement simply being having extremely limited economic resources.

Perhaps they once actually fulfilled their established function, but in recent decades the quality of education in Guerrero has become the poorest in the nation, and as most parents in our state know, our children have simply not been receiving anything close to a decent education from the teachers we have, which include among them graduates from these types of schools.

Greivences and a little background of Ayotzinapa

by katherine @, Wednesday, October 08, 2014, 12:25 (4219 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Rob, thanks so much for the info. I had wondered if these students were among those who demand jobs without examinations, etc. Of course, nothing justifies what happened to them. But this is good info to have.

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Tonight's update...can you imagine the US headlines tomorrow

by casamanzana @, Sunday, October 05, 2014, 21:16 (4221 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

Iguala (Mexico) (AFP) - Gang hitmen linked to police admitted to killing 17 of 43 students missing in southern Mexico, prosecutors said Sunday, amid fears the victims were among 28 bodies found in a mass grave.

Related Stories


1. Mexico checks if 43 students in mass grave AFP
2. Fourteen of 57 missing Mexican students found alive AFP
3. Mass grave found in Mexico raising fears it could hold bodies of missing students Christian Science Monitor
4. Bodies found in Mexico town where students vanished AFP
5. Site of Mexico mass grave is 'land of the wicked' AFP

Inaky Blanco, the chief prosecutor of violence-plagued Guerrero state, said it would take at least 15 days to identify the 28 bodies, some of which were badly burned and in pieces.

The clandestine grave was found Saturday in Pueblo Viejo, an impoverished district of the city of Iguala, where the 43 students were last seen on the night of September 26, some 200 kilometers (125 miles) south of Mexico City.

"A bed of branches and tree trunks was made, on which the bodies of the victims were laid and a flammable substance was used," Blanco said.

The case could become one of the worst slaughters that Mexico has witnessed since the drug war intensified in 2006, leaving 80,000 people dead to date, and by far the most horrific since President Enrique Pena Nieto took office in December 2012.

- Parents hold out hope -


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Students walk past an altar in memory of killed and …
Students walk past an altar in memory of killed and missing peers in Ayotzinapa, Guerrero state, Mex …

Earlier Sunday, some parents and hundreds of fellow students from the missing group's teacher training college blocked the highway between Guerrero's capital Chilpancingo and Acapulco, voicing anger at the authorities.

Some of the parents said they were shown pictures of the bodies but that they did not believe that they looked like their children.

"As parents, we reject this situation. It's not the youngsters. We know they're holding them alive," said Manuel Martinez, whose son is among the missing.

The grim find came a week after the students disappeared when gang-linked municipal police shot at buses they had seized to return home from Iguala, where survivors say they had conducted fundraising activities.

In all, three students were killed in the shooting and another three people died when suspected gang members shot at a football team's bus outside Iguala later that night.


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Mexican marines arrive at the site of a mass grave …
Mexican marines arrive at the site of a mass grave in Pueblo Viejo, on the outskirts of Iguala, Guer …

Witnesses say several students, who are from a teacher training college known as a hotbed of radical protests, were whisked away in police vehicles.

Blanco reiterated at a news conference in Acapulco that Iguala's police force had links to the Guerreros Unidos (United Warriors), one of the state's many ultra-violent gangs.

It was Iguala's public security chief, Francisco Salgado Valladares, who ordered two gang members to go to the site of the students' buses, Blanco said.

The two hitmen then received instructions from a gang leader known as "El Chucky" to take the students and kill them, he said.

The gangsters made students come out of a bus, "they grabbed 17, took them to the top of a hill in Pueblo Viejo where they have clandestine graves and where they say they killed them," Blanco said.

- 'Land of the wicked' -

Authorities have issued arrest warrants for the town's mayor and security chief, both of who have disappeared.

Some 30 people have been detained over the shootings, including at least 22 police officers.

Authorities said the mass grave was located following the interrogation of some of the suspects. Soldiers cordoned off the area but officials said the pit was up a steep hill filled with thick vegetation.

In Pueblo Viejo, a hamlet surrounded by forests and mountains, a resident said the region is dominated by gangsters and that he had seen municipal police officers going up the hill in recent days, before authorities discovered the mass grave.

"They were going up there back and forth," said the resident, Jose Garcia, pointing to a location between two mountains where the graves were found. "This is the land of the wicked."


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View Comments (106) .

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ZIHUATANEJO- A QUAINT LITTLE DRINKING VILLAGE WITH A FISHING PROBLEM.
[image]

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Guerrero de luto

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Monday, October 06, 2014, 08:28 (4221 days ago) @ casamanzana

Guerrero is in a state of mourning. Not a person in the state isn't outraged by this cold-blooded massacre of students from some of the poorest families. I'm not even outraged that some of the students firebombed the Governor's offices as I normally would be. The last thing we need right now are self-serving politicians saying anything to try to save their skins. The responsible parties need to do the right thing and simply resign.

Guerrero has been under the rule of narco-gangs for way too many years thanks to corrupt officials and inept police forces who have never taken their jobs seriously. The governors and mayors and other "public servants" only simulate their jobs and enrich themselves and serve themselves a heaping helpful of our public funds while being accomplices to the organized criminals against whom they have done nothing. Guerrero is currently the worst state in the nation in this respect. Such a dichotomy! Some of the humblest, warmest friendliest people in the world in such a beautiful setting under the yoke of some of the most unscrupulous, corrupt and morally bereft political leaders and their henchmen this side of the Atlantic.

And we put tourist resorts in it and expect people to come while we smile politely.

I believe most of us in Guerrero are going to be calling for the resignation of the governor whose blatant dereliction of duty has allowed the state to slip into its darkest moment. I also believe most of us expect and hope that the federal government will now finally step in and assume control of public security similar (but hopefully better) to what they did in our neighboring state of Michoacán and impose law and order in our state!

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Guerrero Synopsis

by Johnny Briefcase @, Monday, October 06, 2014, 13:40 (4221 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Guerrero de luto

by 2thfaree, Monday, October 06, 2014, 14:59 (4221 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Please be in prayer for the citizens of Guerrero. My husband's cousin was among those shot by the police. He was running away when he was shot in the head. He is in a hospital in a coma now. Needless to say, the family is devastated. They are very poor, and were so proud that he was getting an education. Just 1 week earlier, my husband's brother was murdered. He lived south of Mexico City. So sad.

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Guerrero de luto

by Helene @, Zih, Monday, October 06, 2014, 15:37 (4221 days ago) @ 2thfaree

Oh this is just horrible. I am so sorry for you and everyone else who is suffering.

Guerrero de luto

by katherine @, Monday, October 06, 2014, 16:09 (4221 days ago) @ 2thfaree

I mourn for all who are affected by this senseless violence, and especially for the families of the victims.

bad news out of Guerrero

by katherine @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 07:28 (4220 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso
edited by katherine, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 07:34

Today's New York Times has a front page article on this story. You can read it on-line at nytimes.com CNN also has a story, including an account by a survivor from the soccer team. I thought he was incredibly brave to say what he did.

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bad news out of Guerrero

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 08:13 (4220 days ago) @ katherine

Today's New York Times has a front page article on this story. You can read it on-line at nytimes.com CNN also has a story, including an account by a survivor from the soccer team. I thought he was incredibly brave to say what he did.

The soccer player who was killed on the way back from playing a game was from Zihuatanejo. His name was Daniel Solís Gallardo. Maybe you saw the demonstration at the Cancha Municipal Saturday before last by his family, friends, neighbors and concerned citizens.

very sad news

by katherine @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 08:26 (4220 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I did not see the demonstration, but I had read that he was from Zihuatanejo. Very sad news.

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very sad news

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 09:19 (4220 days ago) @ katherine

I believe there are going to be demonstrations all over the country tomorrow in repudiation of the massacre.

Also, we are hopeful the governor is going to resign because he is the one who by acts of omission allowed the criminals to take control and give orders in Iguala where the Mando Único was not implemented.

bad news out of Guerrero

by Sun Seeker, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 10:17 (4220 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

This is so sad. My heart goes out to his family
and the Zihuatanejo community. Kim

bad news out of Guerrero

by Zwa Billy @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 11:01 (4220 days ago) @ Oeste Hermoso

Any sugestions of a safer route to take in the next two weeks if coming down the coast . Thanks

--
Billy

bad news out of Guerrero

by katherine @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 11:59 (4220 days ago) @ Zwa Billy

If you are actually coming down the coast -- rather than inland -- you should be fine. Stay off the back roads.

bad news out of Guerrero

by Paulf @, Mount Sterling, Ky 40353, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 12:51 (4220 days ago) @ katherine

Normally the toll road is fine between Patzquaro and the Coast.

bad news out of Guerrero

by katherine @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 12:55 (4220 days ago) @ Paulf

:megusta: True.

Route

by Zwa Billy @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 13:16 (4220 days ago) @ katherine

Plan on taking 15 D to 37D down to 200 and in ?

--
Billy

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bad news out of Guerrero

by Linda from Canada @, Zihua and Grand Marais, Manitoba, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 13:17 (4220 days ago) @ katherine

Exactly. Stay on the cuotas and off the back roads- anywhere. If you are coming down the coast, you won't be anywhere near Iguala. Nor will you have the option of a cuota...mex 200 is the only coastal road.

--
Linda from Canada
check out my books at www.livingthedreaminmexico.com AND please have a look at www.cookingwithclaudiainzihuatanejo.blogspot.com as well as www.albertoinzihuatanejo.blogspot.com

bad news out of Guerrero

by Paulf @, Mount Sterling, Ky 40353, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 14:37 (4220 days ago) @ Linda from Canada

Th e last time we were on the toll road there were Federal Police and Military troops all along the road- they were not all at the toll booths.

bad news out of Guerrero

by katherine @, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 15:29 (4220 days ago) @ Paulf

The last time we were on 200 (in May) there were checkpoints along the road (I believe both federal and state). And there were some vigilante checkpoints at some of the small villages as well. But we were always waved through.

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bad news out of Guerrero

by Linda from Canada @, Zihua and Grand Marais, Manitoba, Tuesday, October 07, 2014, 15:59 (4220 days ago) @ katherine

There have been checkpoints on roads, military, federale and agricultural for as long as we have been travelling in Mexico...about 17 years. This is not new. We are so used to it, that I can't even say if we think it is MORE now than it was years ago. We are nearly always waved on, but we have been stopped many times over the years- especially when we were travelling in our RV. Mostly the young guys at the checkpoints just wanted to look inside!

--
Linda from Canada
check out my books at www.livingthedreaminmexico.com AND please have a look at www.cookingwithclaudiainzihuatanejo.blogspot.com as well as www.albertoinzihuatanejo.blogspot.com