Aguacates

by D-Loco, Friday, July 01, 2016, 19:36 (3788 days ago)

Today when I went for my bi-weekly groceries at my favorite Mexican Tienda here in Wisconsin where I live during the summer I paid 1.29 per avocado when they are normally .59 - .79. The senorita who works there said it's due to the Teachers blocking the main routes in Oaxaca. I know this is happening south of Z but are you seeing or hearing of the same or similar effects?

Aguacates

by Zihuateco @, Friday, July 01, 2016, 19:47 (3788 days ago) @ D-Loco

Hard to believe given what occurred in Oaxaca is ten days old.

More than likely end of seasonal supply and supply and demand knowing many Americans will make Guac this weekend.

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Aguacates

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Friday, July 01, 2016, 19:50 (3788 days ago) @ Zihuateco

Hard to believe given what occurred in Oaxaca is ten days old.

More than likely end of seasonal supply and supply and demand knowing many Americans will make Guac this weekend.

The only thing ten days old is the incident in Nochixtlán. The teachers' union continues blocking highways and roads throughout Oaxaca, Chiapas and Michoacán. There have only been some minor roadblocks in Guerrero so far except in Chilpancingo and elsewhere on the Carretera del Sol. They're making sure everyone hates them.

Aguacates - protests outside SFO Mexico consulate

by BL @, Friday, July 01, 2016, 22:11 (3788 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Went today to the Mexico Consulate in SFO, and there was a group of about 15 people (including kids) with placards and screaming to the top of their lungs. Their chants were about teachers, the missing 43, Peña Nieto and Osorio Chong, among others. They were being filmed by a professional looking camera. Nobody at the Consulate seemed to be bothered by them. After 45 minutes they left as peacefully as they arrived. I wonder what is the motivation, the Consul was in Mexico City today...

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Aguacates

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Friday, July 01, 2016, 19:48 (3788 days ago) @ D-Loco

Today when I went for my bi-weekly groceries at my favorite Mexican Tienda here in Wisconsin where I live during the summer I paid 1.29 per avocado when they are normally .59 - .79. The senorita who works there said it's due to the Teachers blocking the main routes in Oaxaca. I know this is happening south of Z but are you seeing or hearing of the same or similar effects?

In Michoacán, the aguacate capital of Mexico, roads are also being blocked. Today the pseudo-teachers blocked our highway between town and the airport. They're really starting to piss people off.

Aguacates

by K&B @, Friday, July 01, 2016, 20:47 (3788 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Does that mean that no traffic can pass? Or is there alternative routes?

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Aguacates

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Friday, July 01, 2016, 23:11 (3788 days ago) @ K&B

Does that mean that no traffic can pass? Or is there alternative routes?

It means lots of people and merchandise get to sit on the highway for hours. Too many vehicles can't get by on alternate roads, when they exist. It means get ready for the crybabies to howl when the government has to crack their heads to get them to move. They're welcome to protest till they're blue in the face, but they don't have the right to affect others.

Aguacates

by victorio, Saturday, July 02, 2016, 00:34 (3788 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Hola
Totally agree that the officials should put a stop to these illegal activities. Why do the teachers feel they have the right to commit all these offenses with impunity? They have caused the death of people. They have committed all sorts of crimes against innocent people. They have caused hundreds of thousands of pesos in property damage, and they continue to do so with total disrespect for every citizen here as well as the law. Enough.

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Aguacates

by jaui @, Zihuatanejo, Saturday, July 02, 2016, 12:58 (3787 days ago) @ victorio

comment by victorio:

"Totally agree that the officials should put a stop to these illegal activities. Why do the teachers feel they have the right to commit all these offenses with impunity? They have caused the death of people. They have committed all sorts of crimes against innocent people. They have caued hundreds of thousands of pesos in property damage, and they continue to do so with total disrespect for every citizen here as well as the law. Enough."

:megusta:

As far as the officials putting a stop to all the illegal activities we are all too familiar with not only in this situation, but for a very long time, this is a bad seemingly never-ending "tradition" here in México.
IMO: COWARDS, both the teachers (aka delinquents) and the MX gobierno.

By now, the teachers know that they can do whatever they want, wherever, whenever, however, etc., y "NO PASA NADA" to the delinquents, Nor do they get their grievances resolved.
I think one of the reasons may be the "strength in numbers" philosophy.
I always wondered, why could they not hire a team of abogados to go up-to-bat for their cause, and negotiate, and in the meantime, continue doing the work they were hired to do?

As far as the government, I think that one reason for the lack of intervention is the fear of increasing the number of fatalities.
Imagine what the reaction would be if a Federal police killed a "teacher", trying to establish order and protects themselves.
Another reason, IMO is an apparent lack of training on how to effectively manage these situations.
Perhaps, there should be one of those "summits" where México could get some counseling on how to deal more effectively, and either prevent them from occurring in the first place, and handle them adequately, when they do present.

As far as the cowardly behavior goes, even on a local level for relatively basic problems, they just don't intervene-- "chickens" as we say.
Activities that are quite obviously not permitted in the "Bando de Policia y Buen Gobierno" are done in flagrancy, and, as usual..."NO PASA NADA."
This is the "freedom" enjoyed in México.

--
jaui

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Aguacates y Revoluciones

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Saturday, July 02, 2016, 13:32 (3787 days ago) @ jaui

comment by victorio:

"Totally agree that the officials should put a stop to these illegal activities. Why do the teachers feel they have the right to commit all these offenses with impunity? They have caused the death of people. They have committed all sorts of crimes against innocent people. They have caued hundreds of thousands of pesos in property damage, and they continue to do so with total disrespect for every citizen here as well as the law. Enough."

:megusta:

As far as the officials putting a stop to all the illegal activities we are all too familiar with not only in this situation, but for a very long time, this is a bad seemingly never-ending "tradition" here in México.
IMO: COWARDS, both the teachers (aka delinquents) and the MX gobierno.

By now, the teachers know that they can do whatever they want, wherever, whenever, however, etc., y "NO PASA NADA" to the delinquents, Nor do they get their grievances resolved.
I think one of the reasons may be the "strength in numbers" philosophy.
I always wondered, why could they not hire a team of abogados to go up-to-bat for their cause, and negotiate, and in the meantime, continue doing the work they were hired to do?

As far as the government, I think that one reason for the lack of intervention is the fear of increasing the number of fatalities.
Imagine what the reaction would be if a Federal police killed a "teacher", trying to establish order and protects themselves.
Another reason, IMO is an apparent lack of training on how to effectively manage these situations.
Perhaps, there should be one of those "summits" where México could get some counseling on how to deal more effectively, and either prevent them from occurring in the first place, and handle them adequately, when they do present.

As far as the cowardly behavior goes, even on a local level for relatively basic problems, they just don't intervene-- "chickens" as we say.
Activities that are quite obviously not permitted in the "Bando de Policia y Buen Gobierno" are done in flagrancy, and, as usual..."NO PASA NADA."
This is the "freedom" enjoyed in México.

I distinguish freedom in the sense that you use it from the vacuum of authority and resulting lawlessness that is increasingly perceived in most parts of Mexico during the past couple of decades.

It's a lot more complicated legally, politically, sociologically and psychologically. You have to understand Tlatelolco and the Guerra Sucia to understand why tolerance of protesters on the part of the government and its institutions seems to be so extreme. It's not cowardice. In the case at hand I believe it's a tactical political strategy that is essentially allowing the dissident teachers to hang themselves with their own rope so that they lose public support. And it's a philosophy that has also allowed Mexico to be a recognized leader in brokering hemispheric peace negotiations. These protests are fueled in no small part by lopezobradorcistas for political gain. It's not just teachers, which was why in Nochixtlán not one teacher was among the dead in spite of sensationalist claims by lots of folks that there was a "teacher massacre" and "repression" by the federal government.

You must remember that for several years Mexico has been restructuring its police forces and we aren't done yet, thus there remains a huge vacuum in public security until all the states sign on and implement the Mando Único. Of course it would help greatly if we weren't also fighting the USA's proxy war on drugs. Both former Presidente Calderón Hinojosa and Presidente Enrique Peña Nieto have toed the line of the USA's government on this matter for too long. Just like they have with NAFTA and now the TPP.

The teachers are wearing out their arguments and their support. I hear them shout out bald-faced lies to motivate themselves in their marches along with political slogans. They try to blame the president for the actions of the Congreso where the reform was passed. They were marching to block the reform before the reform had ever been crystallized and long before it was negotiated and voted on in the Congreso. Not once have I ever heard them elaborate on any specific fact-based grievance with the reform, and not once has any supporter of the dissident teachers explained why they chose to harm the public instead of having negotiations with their union, the other teachers (both from other unions and non-union, most of whom support the reform), their legislative representatives and officials from the Secretaría de Educación Pública (SEP). It's always Peña this and Peña that as if they were still lopezobradorcistas blocking Avenida La Reforma after AMLO lost his second presidential bid (and he's going for strike three).

One thing that has unfortunately characterized what should be the major leftist party in Mexico, the PRD, has been their intolerance of differing points of view. This was magnified under the influence of Andrés Manuel López Obrador when he became their moral leader, insulting presidents and institutions and voters except when it was in his favor not to, and he has carried this same demagoguery and intolerance into his new Morena party where it manifests itself in one of the most intolerant and undemocratic political parties Mexico has ever seen. Though the PRD and Morena self-proclaim themselves as leftist, there is practically nothing "liberal" about them. They don't represent most of my points of view, and Mexico seriously needs a true leftist liberal and progressive party. There are actually times when the traditionally conservative PAN seems much more liberal and leftist than the PRD. In contrast, the traditional success of the PRI has been its ability over the years to fill multiple roles with a strong paternalism, but that's another discussion entirely.

Saludos.

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Aguacates (y Revoluciones)

by jaui @, Zihuatanejo, Saturday, July 02, 2016, 14:05 (3787 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

July 2nd 2016

Thanks for your reply, explanation, and elaboration.
It looks like we got a little off of the main topic of the thread "Aguacates".:-o

I was being a bit sarcastic on my closing comment about freedom, that you correctly interpreted.
Nevertheless, there are people that do enjoy coming to México for that "freedom", knowing that they can do things they would probably NOT do at home, and, most likely GET AWAY WITH here in México.

Besides the "freedom" due to the lawlessness, real freedom should be related to concepts such as free speech, freedom of the press, practice of religion, ability to move about without restrictions, etc., and not to the ability and perceived ease to violate rules, regulations, and laws with complete impunity.

--
jaui

Aguacates y Revoluciones

by bav, Saturday, July 02, 2016, 22:17 (3787 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Prices nothing is simple or easy to understand in Mexico

by mexicowanderer, Friday, July 08, 2016, 16:37 (3781 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

Aguacateros themselves do not haul their product to the mercado de abastos in Morelia. I cannot haul my mangos haden, I tried and was refused with threats. It has to be arranged through a coyote and I was informed my 2016 crop would render a lot less money. I have friends with huertas aguacates in Uruapán Michoacan. It is the same for them. By the time the coyotes take their bite, we work for next to nothing. So I have abandoned my mangos. It just is not worth it. My neighbor and friend Eduardo Chacón did the same with 317 hectarias and fled with family to the USA as indocumentos. Our huertas are in Chucutitán Michoacan. La tierra caliente.

I have no idea what these things mean for the retail market, but Armando my friend in Uruapán is threatening to let the fruit rot on the trees. He owns many hundreds of hectarias of mature trees. They threaten the people who work to pick the fruit. They too have to pay sicarios in order to work.

So it is not just teachers or strikes. It is complicated.

Aguacates

by JohvdelaCruz ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, Gro., MX, Friday, July 08, 2016, 02:16 (3782 days ago) @ ZihuaRob

I was going to argue until I read this. I didn't know that Michoacan teachers had blocked roads too. This state is the number one producer of avocado followed by Gueerrero and then Oaxaca which doesn't produce as much as Guerrero nor Michoacan do.
If teachers block roads in MIC, then it's clear why avocado is high-priced.

http://goo.gl/z59Doq

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Aguacates

by ZihuaRob ⌂ @, Zihuatanejo, México, Friday, July 08, 2016, 09:50 (3781 days ago) @ JohvdelaCruz

I was going to argue until I read this. I didn't know that Michoacan teachers had blocked roads too. This state is the number one producer of avocado followed by Gueerrero and then Oaxaca which doesn't produce as much as Guerrero nor Michoacan do.
If teachers block roads in MIC, then it's clear why avocado is high-priced.

http://goo.gl/z59Doq

Hola Johvani. I also read somewhere that it is the end of the aguacate harvesting season, and for that reason also prices tend to rise until the next harvesting season. Pero no me consta.